Mac App Store

brenty

<div class="IPBDescription">Could 1Password make the jump?</div>I'm sure it's none of my business, but I'm incredibly curious as to the current climate at AWS concerning the imminent launch of the [url="http://www.apple.com/mac/app-store/"]Mac App Store[/url]. <img src='http://forum.agile.ws/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/wink.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=';)' />



Being a fairly advanced computer user, I'm not even sure if buying desktop software from a unified App Store makes sense for me. I use beta software; I like being able to mess around with things; and, frankly, a lot of the software I use probably wouldn't even be approved by Apple.



As far as developers are concerned, I'm sure a lot of it depends on how Apple develops and implements its policies for this new channel, but after your experiences with [url="http://itunes.apple.com/us/app/1password-for-iphone/id285897618?mt=8"]1Password[/url] and [url="http://itunes.apple.com/us/app/1password-pro/id319898689?mt=8"]1Password Pro[/url] in the iOS App Store I thought you folks might have some thoughts to share with the community, even if it might be premature to discuss any plans or announce an actual product.



Of course, there are still a lot of unknowns, but that's what makes it interesting. I'm sure there are others wondering some of the same things. Are you guys as excited as we are? <img src='http://forum.agile.ws/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':)' />

brenty

Aww. Nobody wants to add their two cents to my thread? <img src='http://forum.agile.ws/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/sad.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':(' />

thightower

Hmmm



Well I think the store would be ok for apps like 1P. What about all bookmarks and knox you could argue on one hand they duplicate some things like the OS or MobileMe. Even 1P but I think it would be a streach for any of them. Which duplicating things like the OS would run afoul of the terms if im not mistaken. But thats just like you said most of my apps wouldnt be approved either.



Not being a developer mind you I am just saying it could be a slippery slope for some apps.



Personally I dont think there would ever be a question about 1P.



I am with you tho I like beta apps.

khad

Mmmmmm....



Do you smell that? We've got some fresh ideas cookin'! <img src='http://forum.agile.ws/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/skype_bigsmile.png' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':-D' />



Generally, we try to surprise and delight our customers rather than build expectations only to have things change at the last minute. There have been some great ideas around the ol' water cooler, but under penalty of "death by stereo" I can say no more.



Although, we may have to table [url="http://forum.agile.ws/index.php?/topic/3-suggestion-yubikey-support/page__view__findpost__p__13930"]the socks thing[/url]. The Mac App Store guidelines specifically prohibit footwear. <img src='http://forum.agile.ws/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/skype_tongueout.png' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':-P' />

brenty

[quote name='khad' timestamp='1289441944' post='14875']

Generally, we try to surprise and delight our customers rather than build expectations only to have things change at the last minute. There have been some great ideas around the ol' water cooler, but under penalty of "death by stereo" I can say no more.

[/quote]



I completely understand. This was exactly why I spent a year of complete secrecy as I waited for my girlfriend's contract to expire so I could get her an iPhone. Sometimes when you're excited about something it's hard to keep your mouth shut, though! <img src='http://forum.agile.ws/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/wink.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=';)' />



[quote]

Although, we may have to table [url="http://forum.agile.ws/index.php?/topic/3-suggestion-yubikey-support/page__view__findpost__p__13930"]the socks thing[/url]. The Mac App Store guidelines specifically prohibit footwear.

[/quote]



I am crushed. I was really hoping to goad you guys into announcing their release with the launch of the Mac App Store. It would have been so beautiful, but I guess I will have to continue installing my own socks for the foreseeable future. <img src='http://forum.agile.ws/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/sad.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':(' />

Mike B

Hi Guys,



I've just signed up to this forum to share my thoughts of the Mac App Store.



I'm sure you have some very clever plans but after watching how different developers are handling the launch, what it means to them and how they operate their business in the future I see some choices that I hope Agile will avoid.



Primarily my concerns are around the way that - currently - the MAS does not allow grandfathering of existing users and does not allow for discounts for version upgrades for existing users already in the MAS. As an example, I see Realmac Software has chosen operate exclusively in the MAS and to half the price of Rapidweaver (for an undisclosed period of time) to entice users over to the MAS. How long will this last though? What happens when the price goes up and the next version is released? Same can be said for Aperture or Apple Remote Desktop, even Apple aren't admitting what their reasons are for the reduced pricing.



My hope is that given your already established profile and presence, Agile will be able to take a wait-and-see approach to the MAS. Perhaps until the dust has settled and - hopefully - until Apple relents and allows upgrade pricing/vouchers. Otherwise how would Agile be able to continue with such generous and fairly creative offers such as the Thanksgiving give away or any of the other promotional initiatives you've used in the past? As it stands I don't see how the MAS allows any developer to offer any sort of generosity to the existing customers other then offer a lower initial price. A price that I suspect will [i]always [/i]be forgotten by the customer when they have to pay the same price for the next version.



I think you guys charge a fair price for your product and your regular deals mean I have put at least a dozen friends and family onto 1Password. I'm just a little worried that it would be very difficult for Agile to maintain the built-up customer goodwill in a MAS-exclusive distribution environment.



Regards,

Mike

[Deleted User]

[quote name='Mike B' timestamp='1294626664' post='18692']

I've just signed up to this forum to share my thoughts of the Mac App Store.



I'm sure you have some very clever plans but after watching how different developers are handling the launch, what it means to them and how they operate their business in the future I see some choices that I hope Agile will avoid.[/quote]

See this post-launch topic:



[url="http://forum.agile.ws/index.php?/topic/3212-1password-and-the-mac-app-store/page__pid__18693#entry18693"][url="http://forum.agile.ws/index.php?/topic/3212-1password-and-the-mac-app-store/"]1Password and the Mac App Store[/url][/url]

RobYoder

Hi, Mike, and welcome to the forums!



I'm going to reply to your post here, Mike, because it wouldn't fit well if I merged it with the other thread.



However, to other readers, as sjk mentioned, we've [url="http://forum.agile.ws/index.php?/topic/3212-1password-and-the-mac-app-store/"]posted our current thoughts on the Mac App Store[/url] in a pinned topic, and we'd love to hear your comments over there!



[quote name='Mike B' timestamp='1294626664' post='18692']

Primarily my concerns are around the way that - currently - the MAS does not allow grandfathering of existing users and does not allow for discounts for version upgrades for existing users already in the MAS. As an example, I see Realmac Software has chosen operate exclusively in the MAS and to half the price of Rapidweaver (for an undisclosed period of time) to entice users over to the MAS. How long will this last though? What happens when the price goes up and the next version is released? Same can be said for Aperture or Apple Remote Desktop, even Apple aren't admitting what their reasons are for the reduced pricing.[/quote]



Personally, I have a feeling that Apple's doing this to get rid of "upgrades" altogether. I've been holding my breath for a long time waiting for upgrade pricing capabilities to come to the iOS App Store and then the Mac App Store, but I might just die if I hold it much longer. I don't think Apple intends to ever support upgrade pricing. They've reduce the price of their Pro apps so that they'll be a more attractive instant purchase, but if a new version is released, there won't be an upgrade path. You'll just pay for the new version.



"Unfortunately," we, along with most other developers, like to treat existing customers to a reduced price when upgrading to a newer version. It is only "unfortunate" because it means we can't be quite as excited about the Mac App Store as we could if we could still support our customers to the same level that we do today.



[quote name='Mike B' timestamp='1294626664' post='18692']

My hope is that given your already established profile and presence, Agile will be able to take a wait-and-see approach to the MAS. Perhaps until the dust has settled and - hopefully - until Apple relents and allows upgrade pricing/vouchers. Otherwise how would Agile be able to continue with such generous and fairly creative offers such as the Thanksgiving give away or any of the other promotional initiatives you've used in the past? As it stands I don't see how the MAS allows any developer to offer any sort of generosity to the existing customers other then offer a lower initial price. A price that I suspect will always be forgotten by the customer when they have to pay the same price for the next version.[/quote]



See above about upgrade pricing, but yes, we are still hoping that upgrade pricing will be introduced. We're just not holding our breath. I guess we'll know for sure when iWork '11 is released, huh? Our task now is to figure out how we can both conform to the Mac App Store style and still support our customers well. See [url="http://forum.agile.ws/index.php?/topic/3212-1password-and-the-mac-app-store/"]the other thread[/url] for more details about that.



[quote name='Mike B' timestamp='1294626664' post='18692']

I think you guys charge a fair price for your product and your regular deals mean I have put at least a dozen friends and family onto 1Password. I'm just a little worried that it would be very difficult for Agile to maintain the built-up customer goodwill in a MAS-exclusive distribution environment.[/quote]



That's great to hear, Mike! Thanks so much for posting your thoughts!

brenty

[quote name='RobYoder' timestamp='1294681225' post='18719']



See above about upgrade pricing, but yes, we are still hoping that upgrade pricing will be introduced. We're just not holding our breath. I guess we'll know for sure when iWork '11 is released, huh? Our task now is to figure out how we can both conform to the Mac App Store style and still support our customers well. See [url="http://forum.agile.ws/index.php?/topic/3212-1password-and-the-mac-app-store/"]the other thread[/url] for more details about that.



[/quote]



I too am of the opinion that upgrade pricing is just not in the cards as far as Apple is concerned. I'm not sure what you meant by the reference to iWork, though. I'm pretty sure Apple has never offered upgrade pricing for that package. As a matter of fact, I believe only the "pro" apps (Final Cut, Logic, etc.) were available for a discounted price for existing users. iLife sure wasn't (then again, it's free with every Mac...)



It seems like the iOS App Store (and by extension the Mac App Store) are Apple's bid for commoditization of software, the way that they have packaged and sold hardware as fully integrated systems since the Apple II. The best examples of this are the iMac, the iPod, and the iPhone/iPad. You don't see them offering upgrade pricing when you buy a new nano to replace your old one. This seems like a conscious decision, based on a firm product philosophy.



Besides the obvious financial benefits of full pricing for all product releases, I can imagine that it can be quite a support hurdle to deal with upgrade pricing. It could also be confusing from a consumer standpoint. This way, the price is the same for everyone -- and Apple's cut doesn't change either. Is that 30% off of net or gross? This way, it doesn't matter.

khad

For better or worse, I completely agree that upgrade pricing is dead as far as Apple is concerned.