Feature Request: Mac-to-Mac Wi-Fi Sync

Hagni

Hello,



i just downloaded the trial version of 1P and i bought 1P for iPad. After syncing via wifi i must say this is realy a great feature. Works like a charm. The only thing i wonder is: Why can't i sync between my Mac and my MacBook? It seems to be logically consequent to have this feature.

[Deleted User]

[quote name='Hagni' timestamp='1307132834' post='28445']

Hello,



i just downloaded the trial version of 1P and i bought 1P for iPad. After syncing via wifi i must say this is realy a great feature. Works like a charm. The only thing i wonder is: Why can't i sync between my Mac and my MacBook? It seems to be logically consequent to have this feature.

[/quote]



Hello Hagni and welcome to the Forums!



At this time, 1Password does not support Wi-Fi syncing between Macs and/or Windows computers. Dropbox is the preferred sync method, but there are additional choices: [url="http://help.agilebits.com/1Password3/sync_solutions.html"]1Password data file sync solutions[/url]



There are several benefits to using Dropbox over Wi-Fi syncing, including 1PasswordAnywhere functionality, just to name one.



Please take a look at the sync solutions article and reply back with any questions or comments.



Cheers!



Brandt

Hagni

Thank you for your kind response. Just take it as feature request: Syncing my iPad and my Mac can be done by using 1P only, but syncing my Mac and my MacBook needs workarounds using 3rd party software.



Dropbox is not an option, btw.



Regards

Hagni

[Deleted User]

Hagni,



Thanks for replying. Your feature request has been added to the list.



Please continue to visit the [url="http://forum.agile.ws/"]Forums[/url] and [url="http://blog.agilebits.com/"]AgileBits' Blog[/url] for announcements regarding future product enhancements.



In the interim, let us know if you have any questions or issues syncing your Mac and Macbook using whatever 3rd party software you choose.



The help article I linked to in my last post lists some [url="http://help.agilebits.com/1Password3/sync_solutions.html#issues"]known issues with other sync solutions[/url]. We'll do our best to help you with these or any other problems that may occur.



Brandt

khad

Hello Hagni,



I just wanted to add a tiny bit to what Brandt has already written.



[quote]Thank you for your kind response. Just take it as feature request: Syncing my iPad and my Mac can be done by using 1P only, but syncing my Mac and my MacBook needs workarounds using 3rd party software.[/quote]

The reason for this is that Apple does not allow iOS apps to interact with each other directly. Therefore it is by necessity that Dropbox syncing (and Wi-Fi syncing) are built into the 1Password iOS apps. Mac OS X has no such restrictions. All OS X applications have full access to the file system, so 1Password data can be securely synced between Mac (and Windows) by third party software. This makes it much easier to find a sync solution that works [i]for you[/i] rather than depending on AgileBits to implement your pet sync solution. <img src='http://forum.agile.ws/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/skype_smile.png' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':-)' />



[quote]Dropbox is not an option, btw.[/quote]

I am curious why this is. Perhaps if I know some additional details about what you are looking for I can recommend an appropriate sync solution for you. Please let me know.



Thanks!

Hagni

Hello and sorry for the delay,



thank you for your responses.



Let me first explain my user scenario: I have a workstation (MacMini), a Notebook (MacBook) and an iPad. I want all devices to be in sync. Data changes happen on all devices. Access to the data from another computer is not necessary. I rather want to have the data ONLY on those devices.



I don't like the dropbox solution because:

1. I need to install client software from a third party. This is uncomfortable (I bought a software and need ANOTHER software) and i don't like what the software does. It runs as background process, scans my file system and transmit data from there to wherever and back. Similiar to the most trojan if i might say so. Though you trust this software it is a security threat anyway.

2. I need a dropbox account for which i must give away my user data.

3. I must copy my most valuable files on a 3rd party server which is public available. In my opinion this is a serious security decrease because it breaks the number one rule of secret data: Limit the accessiblity at any costs.

4. I'm committed to dropbox and their services.

5. Another problem that dropbox and the other server based "sync" solutions have is that they sync files and not content. This means when i change an identity on my MacMini and on my iPad (and they are not permanently online) i will loose the changes from one device.



As you see the dropbox thing has several disadvantages meanwhile i see no advantage for my user scenario. Wifi sync on the contrary provides all i need:

-I keep the data in my local network

-It works out-of-the-box

-It merges content!



This makes wifi sync for me more comfortable, more safe, superior regarding the functionality and i'm really very happy with it. It is a top feature of 1P for iPad. The only thing so far is that i can use wifi sync only for MacMini <--> IPad communication and not for MacMini <--> MacBook communication. That's why i committed this feature request.



I hope i could make my situation more clear.

khad

[quote]Hello and sorry for the delay,[/quote]

No worries. I'm still here. <img src='http://forum.agile.ws/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/skype_smile.png' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':-)' />



[quote]1. I need to install client software from a third party. This is uncomfortable (I bought a software and need ANOTHER software)[/quote]

In the same manner than I need to install Audacity if I want to edit the audio I record with QuickTime, Dropbox performs an additional function which is not part of 1Password's core functionality at this time.



[quote] and i don't like what the software does. It runs as background process, scans my file system and transmit data from there to wherever and back. Similiar to the most trojan if i might say so. Though you trust this software it is a security threat anyway.[/quote]

Dropbox is certainly not a Trojan. If it was, they would be out of business already. It is not difficult to monitor the behavior of an application running on your machine. Have you found any suspicious activity? I know the good folks at Dropbox (and the tech media) would like to know if you have uncovered something nefarious.



You don't even have to sync anything more than your 1Password data (which is encrypted) with Dropbox. This is no more a security threat than your web browser. While you are certainly safer not using a web browser, it provides functionality which some consider essential to the modern computing experience. The choice is always yours, though.



[quote]2. I need a dropbox account for which i must give away my user data.[/quote]

I'm not sure what you mean by this, but you can create an anonymous email account using a unique generated password and sign up for Dropbox using the anonymous email account also with a unique generated password. Dropbox doesn't need to know a thing about you. They also can't read your sensitive 1Password data since it is encrypted on your machine before being sent (over an encrypted connection) to a — yes encrypted once again — server.



[quote]3. I must copy my most valuable files on a 3rd party server which is public available. In my opinion this is a serious security decrease because it breaks the number one rule of secret data: Limit the accessiblity at any costs.[/quote]

I think the one rule of encryption — if there is only one — is probably, "Don't give anyone else the key." <img src='http://forum.agile.ws/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/skype_smile.png' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':-)' />



[url="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kerckhoffs's_Principle"]Kerckhoffs's Principle[/url] states it as: "A cryptosystem should be secure even if everything about the system, except the key, is public knowledge."



From the beginning, we have designed the 1Password data file so that your username and password data (along with other secret data stored within it) is protected no matter whose hands it falls into.



1. Your master password is never transmitted from your computer or device.

2. All 1Password decryption and encryption is performed on your computer or device.

3. The 1Password data format was designed to withstand sophisticated attacks if it fell into the wrong hands.

4. Dropbox provides an additional layer of encryption.



When we first designed 1Password we anticipated that some users would have their computers stolen. The same security measures that we we built into the design of the Agile keychain for dealing with the theft of a computer also keep your private data safe should cloud storage be compromised.



Please read our "[url="http://help.agilebits.com/1Password3/cloud_storage_security.html"]Cloud Storage Security[/url]" document for much greater detail.



[quote]4. I'm committed to dropbox and their services.[/quote]

[i]We're[/i] not. <img src='http://forum.agile.ws/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/skype_smile.png' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':-)' />



We are [i]always[/i] investigating [url="http://forum.agile.ws/index.php?/topic/5006-cloud-syncing-options/"]other sync options[/url]. It's part of what keeps us Agile.



There are many sync solutions [b]which will work over Wi-Fi[/b] to keep your Macs in sync, including [url="http://www.econtechnologies.com/pages/cs/chrono_overview.html"]ChronoSync[/url], [url="http://samba.anu.edu.au/rsync/"]rsync[/url] ([url="http://arrsync.sourceforge.net/"]arRsync[/url]), and [url="http://www.cis.upenn.edu/~bcpierce/unison/"]Unison[/url]. While this is not an exhaustive list, it includes some popular options and is a great starting point for finding a solution that suits your needs. If there are certain known issues, the information will be provided in the [url="http://help.agilebits.com/1Password3/sync_solutions.html"]1Password Sync Solutions[/url] document to which Brandt linked above.



[quote]5. Another problem that dropbox and the other server based "sync" solutions have is that they sync files and not content. This means when i change an identity on my MacMini and on my iPad (and they are not permanently online) i will loose the changes from one device.[/quote]

I'm not sure I understand your distinction between files and content. The way the [url="http://help.agilebits.com/1Password3/agile_keychain_design.html"]Agile Keychain Format[/url] is designed, each item is stored in a discrete file. 1Password actually handles sync conflicts [url="https://www.dropbox.com/help/36"]in conjunction with Dropbox[/url] with 1Password's built-in Sync Conflict Resolver ([b]Help > Tools[/b]). The same Sync Conflict Resolver is used for Wi-Fi syncing since the conflicts are detected on a per-file basis regardless of sync method. In the Agile Keychain Format, an item is synonymous with a file. Your data [i]appears[/i] as a single file in OS X, but it is really a [i]bundle[/i] comprised of numerous little files each representing items in 1Password. This is part of what makes 1Password so ideal for sync solutions of all kinds. You can choose what you are comfortable with and it will likely work since all the hard work has already been exerted making the data format [b]specifically tuned for syncing[/b].



You get to choose the solution that fits you best. You are not locked into Dropbox syncing. <img src='http://forum.agile.ws/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/skype_smile.png' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':-)' />



In your case, I would recommend any one of the local sync solutions which require no Internet connection to keep your data synced across your Macs. ChronoSync is probably the most user-friendly, but there are other "freer" options as well. You can sync via Wi-Fi from either Mac to you iPad and never need to use Dropbox if you don't want to. In fact, you can also use your iPad as a sync hub and just perform Wi-Fi syncing between your Macs and iPad to keep everything in sync. Nothing more to learn. Nothing more to set up. Boom! (As Steve Jobs would say.)



Your comfort level with Dropbox syncing is entirely a personal decision. I just want to make sure you (and others coming across this thread in the future) know all the reasons we at AgileBits use Dropbox syncing every day. We are very confident when we recommend cloud syncing of 1Password data with Dropbox, and we believe our users can also have this confidence.



To anyone following along at home, please do take a look at our [url="http://help.agilebits.com/1Password3/cloud_storage_security.html"]Cloud Storage Security[/url] document for the lowdown on just how secure your 1Password data really is. You may be very pleasantly surprised.



Please let me know if there is anything else I can help with. Thanks for bringing up these excellent points!



Cheers,

Catcher

If you're just looking to sync between Macs then SpiderOak and Wuala work well. Be good if Agile could amend the 'other sync software list' at some point.

[Deleted User]

[quote name='Catcher' timestamp='1307894379' post='29052']

If you're just looking to sync between Macs then SpiderOak and Wuala work well. Be good if Agile could amend the 'other sync software list' at some point.

[/quote]

Hey Catcher,



Thanks for posting the additional sync options.



Currently, AgileBits is in the process of updating their product guides, and I'm confident that the other sync software list may grow.



Cheers!



Brandt

Hagni

[quote name='khad' timestamp='1307878560' post='29047']

You can sync via Wi-Fi from either Mac to you iPad and never need to use Dropbox if you don't want to. In fact, you can also use your iPad as a sync hub and just perform Wi-Fi syncing between your Macs and iPad to keep everything in sync. Nothing more to learn. Nothing more to set up. Boom! (As Steve Jobs would say.)

[/quote]



Brilliant!!!

That is what i was looking for. Makes me really happy.



Thank you, Khad, as well as Catcher and Brandt for your responses. Appreciate.

[Deleted User]

You are very welcome!



Khad has a way of hitting mark, doesn't he? <img src='http://forum.agile.ws/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':)' />



Let us know if you have any additional questions.



Cheers!

khad

Phew! I'm glad we found a solution that works for you. I was worried there for a second. <img src='http://forum.agile.ws/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/laugh.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':lol:' />



Best regards,

Watertight

"In fact, you can also use your iPad as a sync hub and just perform Wi-Fi syncing between your Macs and iPad to keep everything in sync. Nothing more to learn. Nothing more to set up. Boom! (As Steve Jobs would say.)"



Khad, you will be pleased to know the system works. I'm antediluvian since I'd just as soon not introduce Dropbox into my presently stable pond. I have an iMac, a MacBook and an iPad each with the appropriate 1P app installed. I consider 1P the greatest timesaver and productivity enhancer I've found in years. However, I'd been employing a sneaker net (the thumb drive version) to sync between my primary machine (iMac) and the MacBook. I was copying the Agile keychain file to the thumb drive from iMac and then replacing the corresponding file on the MacBook. The results began to be sufficiently unreliable for me to consult the Forum to see what I could find. I found this thread. I also found your suggestion quoted at the top of this post.



FWIW, using my iPad as a "sync hub" indeed delivered a "Boom!" and I am delighted. Everything is in sync. While it's still a sneaker net, it's easy and (frankly) kinda fun. Perhaps I'll discover the joy of Dropbox some day, but, for now, it's an iPad Sync Hub and enjoying the Boom.



Thanks for what continues to be the best customer service operation I've found yet.



Terry

khad

Terry, I'm tickled pink. Thanks for the update and kind words. <img src='http://forum.agile.ws/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/skype_smile.png' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':-)' />



As it sounds like you already know, we are always here to help. Let me know if you ever need anything else.



Cheers,